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New Sirio Gain Master 5/8
Topic Started: Sunday, 12. December 2010, 05:54 (21,442 Views)
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Marconi
Tuesday, 14. December 2010, 19:23
Simon see if I understand this just to be sure, OK?


Yes Marconi that is indeed the pigtail that goes inside the antenna.

1st series there was nothing on the end, just the coax ended
2nd series there was the metal stub with the inner core of the coax just at the end visible
3rd series NOW I HAVE has this rubber cover over it and not sign of the coax inside

So indeed that is the end that sits on the inside of the antenna at the bottom section, sits free inside the base
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Here is what DL4OBG says about the antenna and the photo here is his picture with my circle where the burn occurs:

This antenna is unique, a link for 10 and 11m. 10m indeed is one of my favorite bands of shortwave.
Interestingly, the unconventional structure of the inner life of this still very new on the market antenna.

Although perhaps the gain may not be as high as promised, at least that is the broad-band a very good argument for the antenna.




Some time ago I received this antenna now comes naturally and immediately take a close look.
The process looks very solid, and above all, it is thought through.
The assembly instructions are understandable to someone who was not, as noted elsewhere times, is in the comic book world at home.
Except for a roll PVC tape and common tools in the form of screwdrivers, wrenches, etc. Everything is there even an Allen key to fix the top, the pipe out radiator wire in the appropriate clamping with a set screw and a small wrench to the inner coaxial zusammenzuschrauben. For this is still recommended for holding pliers.

The mast clamp body for the antenna of sufficient strength aluminum continuous casting material, such as they are Diamond knows of her antennae.

Of course I was interested in the detailed internal structure, but which is hidden because of the total weather protection very seriously taken part in vigorous shrink tube with additional silicone sealant.

The curiosity got now but once, and the upper separation point, where the pretty red coaxial cable (similar RG58) was in the upper beam splitter was summarily stripped.
The coupling is, in fact, than by a switched capacity, about 11cm long Teflon pan-Koaxstück from RG303. It is roughly the dimensions are also comparable with RG58, but in the quality (Teflon, silver plated wire) much better. The effective length of the capacity is about 9cm, and it results in a capacity of about 8.5 pF.
The coupling of "resting" on a 2.5 cm long and was just as hard again Platinchen weatherproof sealed with sealant and heat shrink tubing. This measure may appear entirely appropriate, but rain water in small amounts through the Bracket clamp the telescope-like, very solid plastic pipes penetrate. If water gets into the Koaxschirm, it will ruin its quality. This must be prevented and is easily reached in the present design. So that the water is not in the lower part of the antenna can be stowed, is the construction of an open bottom. In the final assembly were also wrapped the screw location of the inner coax connection and the outer tubes in the transition with PVC Isoband to minimize the intrusion of rain water even further. The end cap on the brass clamp on top, which fits very accurately and delay is sucking, will also prevent the ingress of water very well.







Broadband





But even with good floor space at the installation is a kind of "antlers" to bring only a certain determination on the mast. Despite the relatively low weight, the story is yes, but always a little shaky. Care should be taken that allow the mast clamps enough room to get to the first antenna on the mast. Slide the brackets during the placement back too far into the correct Alublöcke, rather then sell it again, and try again. But the thing is done ...

Now once again to the "inner values" that I have this image of the 2-to-find images on the net (and the antenna included) put together and commented accordingly and dimensioned.

Now for the first tests. So that the antenna rather than the previously mounted half-wave for 10 and 11m only by the greater length "wins," I do not have the mast moved out completely, but left nearly 2m reserve yet. Of course, results in a part of the improvement, if indeed there is a, yes, in any case by the greater length. The longer antenna always has therefore also a wider horizon. To compensate for that something that is first testing the antenna tip and only slightly higher than the half-wave was.

First measurement was of course the adaptation. And this is indicated in the chart by 2 adjacent SWR-minima is indeed very wide.
There are only slight alterations to the chart, since my antenna is not an infinite amount and certainly not built on an ideal surface. The SWR of about 1.5 are limits to my measurement at 25.4 MHz and 29.6 MHz, the small central "hump" in the diagram with a slight mismatch is mine at about 27.5 MHz. By the still low height may explain the slight deviation to the published graphs.
A measurement of the resonance points of the antenna with a Grid Dipmeter showed that the actual resonance points are well outside the bands. This is not surprising, because response and adaptation to 50 ohms impedance fall together is not necessarily physically conditioned.
In any case, this one antenna, once the complete 10m band covers well and in addition the entire 11m band. As the antenna with band openings (Sporadic-E season in the spring!) Then shows will turn out. Although it is grown on very low elevation angle, on the other hand, the space waves are disadvantaged by not excessive. And if for any missing DX 3dB times, so in most cases, the QSO still in the box!

First measurements on some radio show partners now the tendency that can be reported here, despite comparable antenna height on both sides to have a few more dB on the end-fed half-wave.
Although there is no miracle antenna, it definitely shows its mettle!
It is certainly no cheap product, but it appears in the processing and material choice, that this effort has a price. The engineers who have devised and constructed do finally buy their bread;)

After its construction, to which I shall say a few words, the Master Gain a center-fed, prolonged half-wave and certainly not a 5 / 8. The extension and thus the top emitters of inductively loaded antenna is half of the series capacitor back into resonance. The lower part, the low end by a large standing wave trap was terminated, is compensated by the Anpaßstub frequency and impedance-correct way.
By shifting the upper and lower resonance points also results in the so-called from the filter technology "slightly above critical coupling" with the little saddle of in the middle, which just shows this simple and completely non-critical mismatch in the middle diagram. It is also certain that radiation pattern averaged (mgw at the band limits available), but now that I once had a penchant for unusual, this antenna was a must for me.

Some have already speculated beforehand that such a broadband antenna must be lossy necessarily true to the motto that the broadband accounts, namely a dummy, not finally shines.
But this is not necessarily scalable and this conjecture is not necessarily true. But if the information is not stopped at the "Roth", one must also discuss in the way no more. There are very wide-band antennas that are not necessarily lossy (discone, log periodic., Multibanddipole, hares ear spotlight, cage antenna, etc.). Sure, their "profit" is limited, but there are no dummies!
This is entirely and absolutely for this antenna

So is for those who like me, open to new things, the antenna can bring much joy without retuning! Also on 15m and other bands I've already tested "

To read In German then please look at: http://pct.game-host.org/~lutzg/~hpage/bst1/049ea59cbc125fa07/index.html
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The review unit I got Simon has the silver end on the pigtail lead. Mines still going strong. Only put 80 Watts through mine though.
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Mark in Essex
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Simon...so if and when a delivery of a new GM turns up i am looking for the Revision 3 with the modified rubber coated end.yes ?.....

Max Power 500 Watts (CW) continuous, 1000 Watts (CW) short time according to Sirio's web page...so will this antenna run all day long on at 400-500 watts SSB? :unsure:
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Marconi
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Mark in Essex
Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 02:02
Simon...so if and when a delivery of a new GM turns up i am looking for the Revision 3 with the modified rubber coated end.yes ?.....

Max Power500 Watts (CW) continuous, 1000 Watts (CW) short time according to Sirio's web page...so will this antenna run all day long on at 400-500 watts SSB? :unsure:
Mark I tuned my Swan Mark II up with about 18 watts of drive on ssb out of my Galaxy 2547 into my Gain Master and it worked fine with normal conversation time on the key. With two 3-500z's coasting on output at 400-500 watts I saw no problems. I'm not sure how the amp problem progressed with the guys that had problems thus far, hopefully it might have happend on 1st key and was not progressive, else I too might eventually have a problem hitting the antenna that hard.

I don't think my antenna has any revisions, because it was one of the recent first release orders from H & Y - USA.

Simon, an answer to Mark's question here will also help me to understand what I am looking at in the images you posted. I think I described, in error, what I thought I was looking at in my last post to you. Could it be that Sirio in the last revision just added shrink wrap to the pig-tail end of the matching stub like you described? I could take it out and do that. The report talked about a possible water problem in the matching harness, do you think that is the possible culprit.

Marconi
Edited by Marconi, Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 04:59.
Ole' Grandpa South of Corpus Christi, Texas

I run an original Starduster @ 47' feet. If I can hear you, I can talk to you...if you're listening!

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Mark in Essex
Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 02:02
Simon...so if and when a delivery of a new GM turns up i am looking for the Revision 3 with the modified rubber coated end.yes ?.....

Max Power500 Watts (CW) continuous, 1000 Watts (CW) short time according to Sirio's web page...so will this antenna run all day long on at 400-500 watts SSB? :unsure:

If you look on the photo you can see where the pigtailed end is. First time mine was just coax and was burned and then the actual hole was up the cable just where it joins the shrink wrap. And now the second failure is in the same place.

Runs all day at 500w SSB, not any issues at all. Just this time failed with the KL203 so am not sure what went wrong really.

Hard to say about the version, only a handful of people had issues with any of the series, I have tested mine at various levels of power and this could be the reason. They really are not keen on power it seems, and remember you cannot see what is on the inside until you open the box.
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Marconi
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Simon the Wizard
Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 04:56
Mark in Essex
Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 02:02
Simon...so if and when a delivery of a new GM turns up i am looking for the Revision 3 with the modified rubber coated end.yes ?.....

Max Power500 Watts (CW) continuous, 1000 Watts (CW) short time according to Sirio's web page...so will this antenna run all day long on at 400-500 watts SSB? :unsure:

If you look on the photo you can see where the pigtailed end is. First time mine was just coax and was burned and then the actual hole was up the cable just where it joins the shrink wrap. And now the second failure is in the same place.

Runs all day at 500w SSB, not any issues at all. Just this time failed with the KL203 so am not sure what went wrong really.

Hard to say about the version, only a handful of people had issues with any of the series, I have tested mine at various levels of power and this could be the reason. They really are not keen on power it seems, and remember you cannot see what is on the inside until you open the box.
The fix to your first failure was to add the brass end cap to the pig-tail, right? Then it failed again, right?

Two failures in the same place, at the capicator, inside the shrink wrap, where the black wire starts, right?

And, hopefully now the third fix is to shrink wrap the brass end cap on the pig-tail, right?

Was there signs of heat on the pig-tail end that had nothing but coax the first time? Maybe the pig-tail end also needs to be insulated with shrink wrap, it may be getting hot and short the coax cover beside it inside the FG randome.

What did Sirio send you to fix the antenna?

Marconi
Edited by Marconi, Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 05:22.
Ole' Grandpa South of Corpus Christi, Texas

I run an original Starduster @ 47' feet. If I can hear you, I can talk to you...if you're listening!

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Marconi
Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 05:05
The fix to your first failure was to add the brass end cap to the pig-tail, right? Then it failed again, right?

Two failures in the same place, at the capicator, inside the shrink wrap, where the black wire starts, right?

And, hopefully now the third fix is to shrink wrap the brass end cap on the pig-tail, right?

Was there signs of heat on the pig-tail end that had nothing but coax the first time? Maybe the pig-tail end also needs to be insulated with shrink wrap, it may be getting hot and short the coax cover beside it inside the FG randome.

Marconi

Two Failures at the same place, YES indeed you are correct inside the shrink wrap almost at the end of it

YES now there is a rubber condom like boot over the end of the pigtail now. There was also black residue on the inside of the antenna around the area of the burn

On the 1st antenna where there is NO pigtail, just simply an ended piece of coax there was black burn marks.
Now on the 2nd antenna there is NOTHING near the pigtail just the photographed burn at the shrink wrap end.

Do, emailed Sirio and waiting any news from them. I have here now 2 antennas and both of them have had a failure. The initial one where the coax was ended and not any pigtail at the end. The insides were replaced with the ones with the silver metal ended coax and this has failed, and now this time i have re-built the antenna with the rubber covered end and will try and see how this one is now......
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@ Mr Marconi

YES it appears that shrink wrap was added to the pigtail on the last insides that i have here.

1st One That had simple coax ending with nothing there
2nd Has the metal cover and seems that there is the centre of the coax joined at the end
3rd has the rubber boot over the end, and you can see the pigtail and coax the same

So,, yep seems to be the addition of the boot that is all has happened with it
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Last News. Antenna is off air, emailed Sirio and one of the designers emailed me and could not believe there was another failure and asked me to send some more photos, that is done. I will send via DHL to them the inside of the antenna and let them have a look at it.

500w all antennas are tested at they told me. Well 2 of mine failed with lot less than 500w and I know now of 8 people in UK and other EU places that have suffered the same fate so we will wait and see.

Now, Venom 1/2 back in command of the skies
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Simon the Wizard
Wednesday, 15. December 2010, 16:43
Last News. Antenna is off air, emailed Sirio and one of the designers emailed me and could not believe there was another failure and asked me to send some more photos, that is done. I will send via DHL to them the inside of the antenna and let them have a look at it.

500w all antennas are tested at they told me. Well 2 of mine failed with lot less than 500w and I know now of 8 people in UK and other EU places that have suffered the same fate so we will wait and see.

Now, Venom 1/2 back in command of the skies
Up until today the maximum I run on the Sirio Gain Master was 80 Watts SSB on 10 Meters. With seeing these failings that Simon has had .I decided to drag a linear out. Both my big valve Ham Linears are in another shack and to be honest weighing more than 25KG not an option to move them. So I got my dads old CTE Galaxy 1KW "Oldskool" mains tube amp out that covers the CB bands and 10 meters (I wonder if anyone remembers these Bad boys?).I tried the Sirio Gain Master on FM mode getting on for their stated max power claim . I have an Antenna Solutions digital power meter with an SWR alarm function ,which I set . I left it keyed up for a good few minutes on and off ect and nothing untoward seemed to happen. I realy didn't want to push it any further , as I don't want to take the antenna down. I realy think (if possible) this antenna should take a KW if the design parameters will allow it. Most my Mates around here run the SGM on FM CB with modest power levels . Even on 10 meters we can only use 400 Watts ERP legally. So I guess we'll have to wait and see the outcome. :doh2:
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Newly Installed inside now on the antenna. SWR is nice the same as always, and now let us see what happens. This time we have the "pigtail" wrapped inside the condom like rubber.

My OWN theory, based on nothing at all. During the failure last time, was snowing heavily and so i wondered if something made this small piece short and thus cause the failure. NOT KNOWN, just my own thinking here.

This morning DHL Post have sent the insides to the Development Team at Sirio so let us see what they can find out if anything after natale
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Tested to 200w AM/FM and 400w SSB and the antenna survived to live another day :clap:
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Simon the Wizard
Thursday, 16. December 2010, 12:09
Tested to 200w AM/FM and 400w SSB and the antenna survived to live another day :clap:
Good News .....lets hope this flaw is soon put right, I guess problems and issues are only found by those who try the products. At least Sirio don't stick their heads in the sand. I'm sure any other user will get a FOC update if the part fails. :cheers:
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So here guys is the news about the burned piece that returned to Italy. The designer of the antenna has been in touch and here is the news of the antenna:

The piece that failed was a "pre-series" piece. The newer ones now have the plastic boot and metal cover underneath it (so it seems)

AM POWER

For AM modulation, you should be careful. Considering the worst case of 100% modulation AM, to have the same voltage (peak-peak) at the antenna connector, the power must to be 1/4. So the maximum power into the antenna cannot be more than 125 watts

SSB/FM

Absolute Maximum of 500watts into the antenna. Not more than this.

So, in the advert where it shows 1kw is not actually correct in itself (my words)

500 Watts (CW) continuous, 1000 Watts (CW) short time

This is the advertised and it is actually 500w FM/SSB and 125W AM with 100% modulation
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On an American forum one of our members states i used "800w FM and melted the antenna" which he stated was "abusing it"

I NEVER DID THIS, i never ran more than a KL500 amplifier with the antenna, and if that makes 800w then so be it.
So, do not believe all you read. Also my photos were used there without permission and asking me if they could be transferred to another place.

So, I lay the warning here plain and simple "ASK BEFORE YOU TAKE"
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Talking of Gain Masters Simon, how you getting on with the latest update of it?? :)
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Oggy
Monday, 3. January 2011, 11:11
Talking of Gain Masters Simon, how you getting on with the latest update of it?? :)

Too bad weather to install it Dave. Am back /P with the TP5 or Venom at the moment
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Simon the Wizard
Monday, 3. January 2011, 11:31
Too bad weather to install it Dave. Am back /P with the TP5 or Venom at the moment
OK Simon, mines still working fine..........back to work tommorow :(
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When took it down was working without any issues at all. No complaints and was doing the business.
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